US Northwest June 2020 WABDR - Washington Backcountry Discovery Route

[armyRN]

We still need to confirm the starting place and time. Or are we going with the original start place of The Bridge of The Gods, and time? Vance.

I would suggest to everyone: if you're just checking back into this thread now, to go back a page (or two) and read post #248 through #253 (on page 13). Those posts go over vehicle requirements, what to bring, what not to bring, when and where we're meeting-up, etc. There's some important info in those posts that you will need and be expected to know.

I'm up for a pre-flight call on Wednesday.

 

[Ubiety]

Just took a quick look at the WX along the route. Be prepared for some rain, at least in the Southern portions of our adventure. Good news is that we should be 60-70+ degrees (F) in the day and bottoming out around 50 at night.

 

[4wheelspulling]

I would suggest to everyone: if you're just checking back into this thread now, to go back a page (or two) and read post #248 through #253. Those posts go over what to bring, what not to bring, when and where we're meeting-up, etc. There's some important info in those posts that you will need and be expected to know.

I'm up for a pre-flight call on Wednesday.

armyRN,
Things on the post have been all over. Everyone with their own Ideas, plans, meet up places and when they can Start or Where. That was why I said we need a conference call to make sure all know the plan. Colonel Red Baron has spoken, now make it so! That is an order! Vance.

 

[oldmopars]

Couple of quick questions, do we need both a Discover Pass and a Forestry Pass? Or is the Discovery pass alone OK?
Could someone explain the PL-Tones? I got my GMRS radio and License last week and other than installing it, I have yet to do more than turn it on to make sure it works. If there is any set-up or programming needed, I may need a little help from the knowledgeable in the group.

 

[4wheelspulling]

Couple of quick questions, do we need both a Discover Pass and a Forestry Pass? Or is the Discovery pass alone OK?
Could someone explain the PL-Tones? I got my GMRS radio and License last week and other than installing it, I have yet to do more than turn it on to make sure it works. If there is any set-up or programming needed, I may need a little help from the knowledgeable in the group.

oldmopars,
I checked with Two Ranger stations last year before I did the section starting at Cashmere and home to Chelan. No one gave me any real information, but said that you don’t need any passes for any of the areas above that they could tell. Might not hurt to call the Ranger Station in Naches, and see if any more information is available. Glad to hear you have a new GMRS and License! Congrats, my friend! Vance.

 

[oldmopars]

Here is my problem, I have the Discovery pass, but the Forest pass is not available. I guess I will just go and not worry about it. If I get a ticket, so be it.

 

[mtn]

With regards to passes, they are not required for merely driving the route. They are typically required for trailheads and in some cases campsites.

One of the suggested campsites is at Leader Lake just south of Conconully. I stayed there 2 years ago, and while camping is free, a Discover pass is required. There was no option to purchase a pass or otherwise pay at the campground. One of the nice options for a modest hike on day 3 is at Umtanum creek, this location also requires a Discover pass. You can find retailers selling the Discover pass at License dealers | Washington Department of Fish & Wildlife

I do not have specific sites in mind where the Northwest Forest pass is required. It's typically needed at trailheads or if we want to stop at a campground or a picnic spot for lunch. Also needed if we want to stop at a campground during the day, of using whatever facilities they have. You can find retailers selling the Northwest Forest pass at Region 6 - Recreation Passes & Permits, including 4 retailers in Yakima.

 

[armyRN]

armyRN,
Things on the post have been all over. Everyone with their own Ideas, plans, meet up places and when they can Start or Where. That was why I said we need a conference call to make sure all know the plan. Colonel Red Baron has spoken, now make it so! That is an order! Vance.

Yes. Things have been all over the thread. And it seems like the person who started this thing has backed out. And we're coming down to the wire.

So to fill a leadership vacuum, Greg Eigsti, Oli Hellevik and I had a teleconference this past Thursday. We are taking the lead on this. After our teleconference we started putting out information (starting on page 13 with post #248, and going to #253). We have a plan, and it has been posted. Those posts tell vehicle requirements, what to bring (of course not all-inclusive), what not to bring, exactly where and when we are meeting, and at what time wheels are rolling to begin the adventure. And a daily time-line (gotta have a plan at least) for days 1-6.

A phone conference would be nice; but if folks aren't checking back on this thread to know about a call, we don't have their email to contact them about the call, or they can't make the call, or they decide at the last minute to attend (after the call), the pertinent information has already been posted (starting with post #248).

So if anyone out there has gotten this far on this thread and wants to know the plan, go back to page 13 and read posts 248 - 253. If nothing else, you will know vehicle requirements, what and what not to bring, and when and where we are meeting. And I would suggest continuing to check-back on this thread for any updates or final tidbits of information as we get closer to Monday.

 

[Ubiety]

Couple of quick questions, do we need both a Discover Pass and a Forestry Pass? Or is the Discovery pass alone OK?
Could someone explain the PL-Tones? I got my GMRS radio and License last week and other than installing it, I have yet to do more than turn it on to make sure it works. If there is any set-up or programming needed, I may need a little help from the knowledgeable in the group.

PL tones are the privacy tones used by GMRS radios to make any particular channel *seem* less crowded. We won't be using them and the only folks interested would be those with ham style radios trying to manually tune in. If you have an out of the box GMRS radio then you would not need the frequency chart. It will become more clear over the campfire ;)

 

[Ubiety]

With regards to passes, they are not required for merely driving the route. They are typically required for trailheads and in some cases campsites.

One of the suggested campsites is at Leader Lake just south of Conconully. I stayed there 2 years ago, and while camping is free, a Discover pass is required. There was no option to purchase a pass or otherwise pay at the campground. One of the nice options for a modest hike on day 3 is at Umtanum creek, this location also requires a Discover pass. You can find retailers selling the Discover pass at License dealers | Washington Department of Fish & Wildlife

I do not have specific sites in mind where the Northwest Forest pass is required. It's typically needed at trailheads or if we want to stop at a campground or a picnic spot for lunch. Also needed if we want to stop at a campground during the day, of using whatever facilities they have. You can find retailers selling the Northwest Forest pass at Region 6 - Recreation Passes & Permits, including 4 retailers in Yakima.

@oldmopars - I picked up a NW forest pass at the Redmond WA Big 5 a few minutes ago. Call ahead to verify hours and availability - guy at front register had a "ticket book" full and ripped one off for me. If all else fails I can get one for you. That said I'm not sure if/how much it is required for this trip.

 

[SCS]

Yes. Things have been all over the thread. And it seems like the person who started this thing has backed out. And we're coming down to the wire.

So to fill a leadership vacuum, Greg Eigsti, Oli Hellevik and I had a teleconference this past Thursday. We are taking the lead on this. After our teleconference we started putting out information (starting with post #248, and going to #253). We have a plan, and it has been posted. Those posts tell vehicle requirements, what to bring (of course not all-inclusive), what not to bring, exactly where and when we are meeting, and at what time wheels are rolling to begin the adventure. And a daily time-line (gotta have a plan at least) for days 1-6.

A phone conference would be nice; but if folks aren't checking back on this thread to know about a call, we don't have their email to contact them about the call, or they can't make the call, or they decide at the last minute to attend (after the call), the pertinent information has already been posted (starting with post #248).

So if anyone out there has gotten this far on this thread and wants to know the plan, go back and read posts 248 - 253. If nothing else, you will know vehicle requirements, what and what not to bring, and when and where we are meeting. And I would suggest continuing to check-back on this thread for any updates or final tidbits of information as we get closer to Monday.

I'm up for a conference call on Wed. Let me know what times you're thinking. I'm free between 8:30am-10am, and after 2pm until 5:30. I could also call in anytime after 6:30pm. Thanks for taking the lead on this trip fellas.

 

[mtn]

Our conference call / driver's meeting is scheduled for Wednesday June 10th at 8pm PDT. I have emailed information where I have an email address, but any participant is free to join by phone.

+1 469-480-6284 United States, Dallas

(866) 641-7188 (Toll-free)

Phone Conference ID: 421 202 125#

Find a local number

 

[Ubiety]

Our conference call / driver's meeting is scheduled for Wednesday June 10th at 8pm PDT. I have emailed information where I have an email address, but any participant is free to join by phone.

+1 469-480-6284 United States, Dallas

(866) 641-7188 (Toll-free)

Phone Conference ID: 421 202 125#

Find a local number

Thank you!

 

[4wheelspulling]

I will not be coming with the group. I have been on different parts of the WABDR and the vehicle required list is not valid for this trip. I could take a 1/2 ton 2wd. Pick up with a limited slip rear axle and do the whole trip! I grew up in an outdoor family, my Dad worked in the woods for a timber company and was the Seaside, Oregon City Manager at the same time. I was in the woods on mountain cat roads or on the beach 4 wheeling with my Dad, or out exploring by myself. I got my first deer at 6 years old, Cub Scouts, Boy Scouts, Pathfinders, I have climbed over 40 mountain peaks, many backpacking trips and camping adventures. I do not ever remember a time my family did not have a 4x4 vehicle. I started driving at 9 years old, because we lived a couple of blocks from the longest driving beach in the world, and had my own car to drive. Yes, you have to have rules, but sorry, this WABDR group trip is a little overblown, with rules for me. COVID -19 type of mentality! Overland Bound has been called a group of “elitist” and now I know why! I know this was written to help all have an idea of what to bring for those that don’t have lots of experience. OB was founded on the premise, that you don’t need a lot of gear to enjoy the outdoors or a fully built 4x4 vehicle. In my lifetime, I have owned and driving more than 20+ 4x4 vehicles, half of them Jeeps. My Jeep is built more than any listed in the group, so that is not the problem. I do not drink any alcoholic beverages. I do not smoke at all, so that is not the reason. I was a respiratory therapist for 10 years, ACLS certified, that is not the reason. I will still do the WABDR trip. And enjoy my schedule and the trip. I will start on the North end and see you heading the other way! Vance.

 

[mtn]

Looks like we might get some mud on Tuesday: Events/Trails - Seattle area role call and planning thread

 

[armyRN]

I'm sorry you feel that way Vance. You asked for a plan, and we gave you a plan.

Since I was the one who wrote the vehicle requirement post (and the what and what not to bring posts), I went back to review it. Here's what I posted:

Vehicle Requirements:

Vehicles should be in good working order. We will be driving about 600 miles total over six days essentially off-pavement. That means cooling system is working well and not leaking, hoses are good, ignition is running strong, good secured battery & wiring, fluids are relatively fresh, brakes are in good working condition, U-Joints are good, etc.; and any known issues have been fixed before the meet-up day. This should be for any Overlanding trip you're planning on participating with, not just this one.

Tires should have good tread on them, and be in good safe condition - preferably not street tires but AT or MT tires. All vehicles must have a full size, mounted matching spare tire with good tread on a proper rim (no temporary spares even if they are of a matching size). Plug kits are great (I've got one), but they only go so far.

Vehicles must have strong tow-points (like tow hooks) front & rear (a 2" receiver also counts as a tow-point). Those bent wire-looking things welded under some vehicles used to tie them down from the factory for transport aren't really tow-points. Even the best set-up overland vehicle sometimes needs a little tug to get over/through an obstacle - there's no shame in needing a tug sometimes. Using a trailer hitch tow ball as a tow-strap attachment point is dangerous - preferred is a D-ring attached to a 2" receiver bracket. Something that looks like this:

https://www.warn.com/dring-shackle-bracket-2in-29312

Each vehicle should have a tow strap or recovery strap (not a chain) of some kind strong enough for the weight of their vehicles. Straps must have loops at the ends, not metal hooks (metal hooks are dangerous).

Must have a jack capable of lifting your vehicle to change a tire (does not have to be a high-lift jack).

Need to have a spare fan belt(s) for your engine. We can repair a busted radiator hose on the trail; we can't tape together a busted fan belt. They're cheap; pick one up at any parts store.

Need a GMRS radio (and a license to go with it). I'll have a spare hand-held or two if you don't have one.

Vehicle must be capable of traveling at least 150 miles using the gasoline you're carrying. Figure we'll be driving relatively slow and not on pavement; you will not be getting anywhere near your normal highway MPG. Plan accordingly - Jerry cans are your friend. When we stop for gas, everyone fills-up or tops-off (sometimes we might have to take a long detour, a gas station we thought would be open might be closed, etc.).

The trails in the PNW are tight with brush in places. Plan on possible trail pinstriping on your vehicle or trailer.

Pretty basic minimal stuff as far as I can tell - what exactly is over-the-top? No mention of even needing 4WD (although I think it is the rare overlander that doesn't have 4WD), no mention of needing lockers, winches, lift kits, high-lift, first aid kit, oversized tires, shovels, traction mats, etc.. I thought I was going pretty minimalistic. Having folks bring a spare fan belt might be new to some folks (maybe), and GMRS is now becoming more common so not everyone has that. If folks have lifted their vehicles, they might want to make sure their factory jack can still lift it enough to change a flat tire. We're not going to have a check-list on Monday morning.

If you check out any of the 4WD magazines or 4WD organizations/clubs that have organized runs, they go into much greater detail as far as their requirements. And always attachment points front and rear, and matching spare tires are required on their runs. I should know; I participated in Four-Wheeler's Overland Adventure East 2019 last year, and they had a huge list of required items (and a check-in with a check-list), and they definitely had an itinerary and hard meeting and departure times. And I've been doing this stuff for years - I've seen (and been part of) well organized runs and not-so-well organized runs. I've learned from both types.

When a person goes on a week-long trip by themselves, they have the luxury of setting their own pace and itinerary, and being responsible only to themselves. I was on a month-long trip this past fall by myself (I literally crisscrossed the country). When you've got a large group going with folks of different levels of experience who may not even know anyone else in the group, someone needs to be in charge, and there needs to be a plan/some sort of schedule. And guidelines for expectation management. We are providing that.

I look forward to meeting you somewhere along the half-way point. Hopefully you can give us some good intel on what to expect for the northern half of the WABDR. Enjoy your trip!

 

[MrWilsonWJ]

Looks like we might get some mud on Tuesday: Events/Trails - Seattle area role call and planning thread

I was up there again over the weekend, and ran the whole ridge with no winching. The snow is gone from the trail but still some deep mud. Overall I think there was more mud 2 weeks ago. The bad parts are still where the trail veers off of the ridge and into the trees, the places that had snow/mud 2 weeks ago are now mud holes. The first one you come to is probably the worst because there isn't a way around it, you just have to find the best line and go for it. Didn't think I was going to make it out but managed to claw through it. I could feel the rig getting hung up so I think anyone with less than 33's might struggle. 2nd mud hole is more about finding a good line to avoid the big ruts, if you get out and walk it first you can find the line that zig zags around the worst of it. 3rd one is not bad, just some muddy ruts with a tight spot from a stump and tree. After that you're pretty much home free for the real mud. If you have trailers in the group you will definitely be doing some trail clearing to open up the tight spots through this section. There is some significant water puddles after the mud section but they are firm in the bottom and I didn't find any hidden surprises. If you take this route and not the "easy" route there is a green dot road you can turn off on and end up at the same place. I recommend the green dot as a bit of a bypass for the really rocky part of Bethle ridge rd. The rocky section is just slow and rough and I don't think there is anything worthwhile that you'd miss. I'll see if I can find a name for it or rd number.

 

[Ubiety]

Thanks to everybody who responded over the weekend to confirm their attendance! All of the attendees should have access to the planning spreadsheet; if you do not please let me know!

The confirmed attendees should have received an invite to @mtn's Wed conference call - speak up if Wed 8pm Pacific does not work!

@mtn
@SCS
@armyRN
@Greg Eigsti
@oldmopars
@Joshua Buss
@Hogman

 

[Ubiety]

Looks like we might get some mud on Tuesday: Events/Trails - Seattle area role call and planning thread

A couple/few weekends back we watched some soupy goop mostly dry up over a couple days. Knock on wood that this area dries up a bit over the next week!

Excited!

 

[MrWilsonWJ]

A couple/few weekends back we watched some soupy goop mostly dry up over a couple days. Knock on wood that this area dries up a bit over the next week!

Excited!

In the 2 weeks between my trips up there it dried up a lot, the first hole you get to will probably dry up some before you get there, at least maybe the approach to it. Between the first and second hole could be interesting for some (I believe that's what is pictured in the previous link @mtn shared) because it is a bit of a mud flat a few inches deep. That flat is where you want to get out and walk the next section to plan a line for the next set of ruts and mud. But I think the second and third one still had flowing water in them from melt off so they might still be muddy. Really it is about a .5-.75 mile mud section with 3-4 obstacles through out it so if you get into it and start to question going on just walk it out before turning back. It's pretty short and not too bad, trailers will be the only additional challenge due to it being tight and slick. I've been through twice now with only 3" lift, 33's and open diffs so I think you guys will be alright if you drive smart and plan your track before heading in. Maybe have someone spot the inexperienced and place the winches staggered through the group.