Higher Fuel Prices And Overlanding

[bgenlvtex]

USD 1.86 per US Gallon - that would be nice. On the assumption made in the question we would presumably double our travel if fuel price dropped to this level... In fact, we consider fuel an inelastic commodity - we buy what we need to travel, and pay whatever the price happens to be - high in Europe, medium in much of South America, Africa, and Canada, cheap in the USA.

Out of interest, of the 166 countries surveyed by statisticstimes.com there are 135 countries with petrol/gas prices higher than those in the USA.

For that to be meaningful they would have to survey the USA as 50 individual countries not as one. The political landscape is vastly different across the country and as a result State and local taxes that are applied.

I bet that they haven't seen $1.86 for regular in Californistan in the last decade, and the same for the other liberal States. High taxation is what is causing the mass emigration from those States.

 

[LostWoods]

For that to be meaningful they would have to survey the USA as 50 individual countries not as one. The political landscape is vastly different across the country and as a result State and local taxes that are applied.

I bet that they haven't seen $1.86 for regular in Californistan in the last decade, and the same for the other liberal States. High taxation is what is causing the mass emigration from those States.

Filled my car for $10 a few times around 2000 when I was in High School... I don't think I saw under $2 a gallon after about 2005 until I left the state in 2011.

 

[Alanymarce]

For that to be meaningful they would have to survey the USA as 50 individual countries not as one. The political landscape is vastly different across the country and as a result State and local taxes that are applied.

I bet that they haven't seen $1.86 for regular in Californistan in the last decade, and the same for the other liberal States. High taxation is what is causing the mass emigration from those States.

Fair point - you're right of course. Even so, California's prices are about the same as Canada's (where it's also necessary to look at the prices in different provinces), and so cheaper than 87 of the 166 countries in the list.

We pay about double the price here in the capital compared to the price in the north of the country.

I have to comment on the "high taxation" as well (somewhat inevitably) - what I recall from paying tax (income, sales, etc.) when I did so in the USA was that it was ridiculously complicated, but ended up noticeably lower than in any of the other countries in which I've paid tax. Now I have no idea how California compares with Texas (where I was paying tax) however my understanding was that the emigration taking place from the former to the latter was driven as much by the price of housing and by corporate tax than by tax on individuals. I'd be interested to learn more, however realise that this forum is not the place for this discussion...

 

[Alanymarce]

Filled my car for $10 a few times around 2000 when I was in High School... I don't think I saw under $2 a gallon after about 2005 until I left the state in 2011.

When I lived in Venezuela it cost about a US quarter to fill the fuel tank. There were disadvantages as well, however : )

 

[KF0APA]

You are simply accepting that high taxes are a good reason for high fuel costs.

I reject that notion categorically. High taxation is a function of inefficient and likely corrupt government.

There is absolutely no shortage of oil, there is in fact a glut. Remember a year and a half ago when oil futures went negative? You probably don't because it wouldn't significantly affect your fuel costs because your fuel costs are predominantly taxes. You accept that, we (I) do not.

The perceived need to shift from carbon based fuels is entirely a scam to shift money, that's it. Appeal to feelings, claim "science" and use both to further fleece the population.

I'm sorry I didn't see that you were from Luxembourg, I for what ever reason thought you were from GB. I ask because I think you lack perspective on how it is here. For example a quick search says the square mileage for Luxembourg is 998. The county I live in predominantly is 593, and the state is 268,000 square miles. If I travel to my second address it is a little over 4 000 miles one way, and the square mileage of that State is 664,000. Just my commute to work exceeds a trip completely across Luxembourg.

You seem to want to attribute "need" in perspective to what you call reality, and that doesn't apply here.

The only reason for fuel prices to be as high as they are in America or anywhere else in the world is a direct result of politics nothing less.

Currently Texas is under winter conditions that are unheard of. Due to political conditions coal generation was shut down, and solar and wind are mandated. Well, guess what isn't producing any power resulting in rolling black outs in Texas during those historical conditions? That's right, the wind and solar, so Texas is without 30% of their generation capacity and people are freezing their ass off.

I keep waiting to hear from one of my leftist "friends" needing help because they have no heat their plumbing is burst and they have no way to get to the store because their greenweanie mobile can't go. I'm going to tell them to go stare into the mirror and then call Greta Thunberg, if she isn't having a seizure from Fetal Alcohol Syndrome she might care, but I won't.

My liberal neighbor needed a ride to the store and work the past 3 days because he couldn't get his electric car charged. Thank Jebus my 8.1 liter glacier destroyer was ready, willing and able to start and get us to and from without issue. Oh I won't mention how many posts I've seen on social media asking for rides for the same reason as my neighbor. And I've never seen the babes fall all over the guy driving the Prius.

 

[bgenlvtex]

Fair point - you're right of course. Even so, California's prices are about the same as Canada's (where it's also necessary to look at the prices in different provinces), and so cheaper than 87 of the 166 countries in the list.

We pay about double the price here in the capital compared to the price in the north of the country.

I have to comment on the "high taxation" as well (somewhat inevitably) - what I recall from paying tax (income, sales, etc.) when I did so in the USA was that it was ridiculously complicated, but ended up noticeably lower than in any of the other countries in which I've paid tax. Now I have no idea how California compares with Texas (where I was paying tax) however my understanding was that the emigration taking place from the former to the latter was driven as much by the price of housing and by corporate tax than by tax on individuals. I'd be interested to learn more, however realise that this forum is not the place for this discussion...

Sales tax is collected at the point of sale , no complication there. One of the first things the previous administration dis was lower taxes for most, particularly the middle and lower income brackets when expressed as a percentage of total income, and simplify the tax code. There are a number of low cost tax software programs, although with the streamlined tax code it is really unnecessary. Personally I pay a CPA to prepare mine, it costs about $500 a year (which is deductible). As you suspect I will happily pay for tax prep as opposed to a higher rate for simplicity.

Basic economics= all taxes levied at the corporate level are passed to the consumer, no different than "minimum wages". People seem routinely surprised when they see that in person, but those same people are generally quite dumb. But you are correct feelings will become swollen and engorged if we discuss that here, so to return to the original topic at hand, fuel costs are going up unquestionably, and there is absolutely no economic (supply and demand)reason for that.

 

[MidOH]

It always entertains me when an overlander with an armor clad rig, that gets 8mpg, mentions that we need to start driving more eco-ish vehicles.

Rules for thee, not for me. Couldn't be more obvious.

 

[MOAK]

You are simply accepting that high taxes are a good reason for high fuel costs.

I reject that notion categorically. High taxation is a function of inefficient and likely corrupt government.

There is absolutely no shortage of oil, there is in fact a glut. Remember a year and a half ago when oil futures went negative? You probably don't because it wouldn't significantly affect your fuel costs because your fuel costs are predominantly taxes. You accept that, we (I) do not.

The perceived need to shift from carbon based fuels is entirely a scam to shift money, that's it. Appeal to feelings, claim "science" and use both to further fleece the population.

I'm sorry I didn't see that you were from Luxembourg, I for what ever reason thought you were from GB. I ask because I think you lack perspective on how it is here. For example a quick search says the square mileage for Luxembourg is 998. The county I live in predominantly is 593, and the state is 268,000 square miles. If I travel to my second address it is a little over 4 000 miles one way, and the square mileage of that State is 664,000. Just my commute to work exceeds a trip completely across Luxembourg.

You seem to want to attribute "need" in perspective to what you call reality, and that doesn't apply here.

The only reason for fuel prices to be as high as they are in America or anywhere else in the world is a direct result of politics nothing less.

Currently Texas is under winter conditions that are unheard of. Due to political conditions coal generation was shut down, and solar and wind are mandated. Well, guess what isn't producing any power resulting in rolling black outs in Texas during those historical conditions? That's right, the wind and solar, so Texas is without 30% of their generation capacity and people are freezing their ass off.

I keep waiting to hear from one of my leftist "friends" needing help because they have no heat their plumbing is burst and they have no way to get to the store because their greenweanie mobile can't go. I'm going to tell them to go stare into the mirror and then call Greta Thunberg, if she isn't having a seizure from Fetal Alcohol Syndrome she might care, but I won't.

Wow, you say everything you have to say as if you do indeed,, just wow- a simple google search provided me with almost the direct opposite facts. It’s like, wow, you state your non researched socio/political opinions as if anyone could take you seriously. Why do you post up your unwanted and very negative political viewpoint on a forum for overlanding? I don’t get it. You expect to write as you do and not be called out on it?

 

[leeloo]

You are simply accepting that high taxes are a good reason for high fuel costs.

I reject that notion categorically. High taxation is a function of inefficient and likely corrupt government.

There is absolutely no shortage of oil, there is in fact a glut. Remember a year and a half ago when oil futures went negative? You probably don't because it wouldn't significantly affect your fuel costs because your fuel costs are predominantly taxes. You accept that, we (I) do not.

The perceived need to shift from carbon based fuels is entirely a scam to shift money, that's it. Appeal to feelings, claim "science" and use both to further fleece the population.

I'm sorry I didn't see that you were from Luxembourg, I for what ever reason thought you were from GB. I ask because I think you lack perspective on how it is here. For example a quick search says the square mileage for Luxembourg is 998. The county I live in predominantly is 593, and the state is 268,000 square miles. If I travel to my second address it is a little over 4 000 miles one way, and the square mileage of that State is 664,000. Just my commute to work exceeds a trip completely across Luxembourg.

I don't want to get in to politics here. Does not matter if I live in what is a small country. In EU it does not mater at all, you travel freely and your business, work or pleasure takes you to whatever place, and it is still a continent, even a if bit smaller overall. I also lived in Romania, Germany, Belgium and for a short while in France. I can make very easy assumptions about you, but I am not. I have visited US as well, not all of it of course.I can't pretend to know it like the back of my hand. That is not the point. You assume because where I live, in this small country that no one drives as much as in US. It the wrong assumption. I have colleagues who don't want to or can't afford the high rents in Luxembourg and they commute even 150 miles round trip to come to work. I am actually looking to buy a small house in Spain, for retirement, they are very cheap there compared to here(In Luxembourg for 600k euro you buy a broom closet with a garage maybe , in Spain for 140 k you get a house with a pool and an orchard..) , . climate is great and so are the spanish people and the food..awsome..and this second house will be aprox 1600 miles from my current one. So yeah, here you work in Norway and have a second house in Greece, or Portugal or wherever...it is actually nothing extraordinary about it.. S
o you second asumption is very wrong as well..
Taxes -- Actually Luxembourg is a tax heaven in the middle of Europe, probably most taxes here are lower than the lowest tax state in the US.
I don't mind paying taxes anyway, when they are spend wisely, I like good healthcare, I like my kids to go to good schools, I don't mind helping others in need. ( in a public school in Luxembourg a primary school teacher brings home about 6200 US $ /month net pay, that is after all the taxes are paid.. )

I am not saying that high taxes are good or the trend of downsizing engines is the best thing ever.

I am saying big engines will be gone - it is happening . There are many ways to skin a cat. In US they can't put high gas taxes because it is political suicide, but they can put a cap on emissions to manufactures so the V8 will be gone in 99% of the next gen vehicles. It is already done. Ford is paying each year Tesla a small fortune in CO2 credits, this will reflect in the price of their cars, so they will do something about it. Electrification will happen even if you don't approve it or like it.
And even tough i want to avoid politics,politics are behind of all that is happening. Right now, if you really care and want to help the environment, you stop eating beef completely ( not all meat, just beef) and keep driving your 5.7 hemi just to commute and heating up with coal or what ever and you will be greener than 99% of the people who bring the small textile bags at the supermarket thinking they are green.
They have a bloody eco shower head, and if you take a bath you are a criminal, than they eat 1 hamburger - 400 gallons of water are consumed to make it .
And yet I don't see the a 100 % tax or duty on milk, or on cows.

This is how I know the most of it is just greenwashing and motorists and car companies are just easy targets.. When I will see 1 euro tax/l of milk like for gas and a kilo of beef at 50 euro I know this people are serious about climate change/environment and hats off...
I have a small hybrid car for every day use because it is ok enough for what I do with it and is very cheap to run, mpg in heavy city traffic is unbelievable .I don't keep it because I think I will save the planet or is a joy to drive.

Plus it is very stupid in policy in Europe to force this green trend when most of the world and biggest polluters like China, India don't do anything. Even if in 10 years EU is carbon neutral and makes itself bankrupt in the process, the impact will be negligible overall..
Sorry for the ramble..

My point is this one, like the topic says, even if the prices of fuel doubles, for what ever reason, politics, oil production crisis, you can adapt, like it happened before. It is how Japan entered the US car market in 70's during the big Oil shock when OPEC was formed.

 

[MidOH]

Frozen wind turbines and natural gas lines just happened in texas, so he's right about that. There's a number of ''narrative pushers'' out there with articles saying ''it ain't the green energy switch's fault.'' That's a sure sign, that it IS green energy's, and their kickback politician's, fault. When in doubt, the truth is the opposite of the ''narrative pushers'' nearly all the time.

The story behind Texas's rolling power blackouts as more are expected Tuesday

Record-breaking cold and generators going offline have led to electric power emergencies for millions of Texans.

www.kvue.com

A friend of mind has ''slush'' in his toilet. That's a new record cold for them.

 

[bgenlvtex]

I don't want to get in to politics here. Does not matter if I live in what is a small country. In EU it does not mater at all, you travel freely and your business, work or pleasure takes you to whatever place, and it is still a continent, even a if bit smaller overall. I also lived in Romania, Germany, Belgium and for a short while in France. I can make very easy assumptions about you, but I am not. I have visited US as well, not all of it of course.I can't pretend to know it like the back of my hand. That is not the point. You assume because where I live, in this small country that no one drives as much as in US. It the wrong assumption. I have colleagues who don't want to or can't afford the high rents in Luxembourg and they commute even 150 miles round trip to come to work. I am actually looking to buy a small house in Spain, for retirement, they are very cheap there compared to here(In Luxembourg for 600k euro you buy a broom closet with a garage maybe , in Spain for 140 k you get a house with a pool and an orchard..) , . climate is great and so are the spanish people and the food..awsome..and this second house will be aprox 1600 miles from my current one. So yeah, here you work in Norway and have a second house in Greece, or Portugal or wherever...it is actually nothing extraordinary about it.. S
o you second asumption is very wrong as well..
Taxes -- Actually Luxembourg is a tax heaven in the middle of Europe, probably most taxes here are lower than the lowest tax state in the US.
I don't mind paying taxes anyway, when they are spend wisely, I like good healthcare, I like my kids to go to good schools, I don't mind helping others in need. ( in a public school in Luxembourg a primary school teacher brings home about 6200 US $ /month net pay, that is after all the taxes are paid.. )

I am not saying that high taxes are good or the trend of downsizing engines is the best thing ever.

I am saying big engines will be gone - it is happening . There are many ways to skin a cat. In US they can't put high gas taxes because it is political suicide, but they can put a cap on emissions to manufactures so the V8 will be gone in 99% of the next gen vehicles. It is already done. Ford is paying each year Tesla a small fortune in CO2 credits, this will reflect in the price of their cars, so they will do something about it. Electrification will happen even if you don't approve it or like it.
And even tough i want to avoid politics,politics are behind of all that is happening. Right now, if you really care and want to help the environment, you stop eating beef completely ( not all meat, just beef) and keep driving your 5.7 hemi just to commute and heating up with coal or what ever and you will be greener than 99% of the people who bring the small textile bags at the supermarket thinking they are green.
They have a bloody eco shower head, and if you take a bath you are a criminal, than they eat 1 hamburger - 400 gallons of water are consumed to make it .
And yet I don't see the a 100 % tax or duty on milk, or on cows.

This is how I know the most of it is just greenwashing and motorists and car companies are just easy targets.. When I will see 1 euro tax/l of milk like for gas and a kilo of beef at 50 euro I know this people are serious about climate change/environment and hats off...
I have a small hybrid car for every day use because it is ok enough for what I do with it and is very cheap to run, mpg in heavy city traffic is unbelievable .I don't keep it because I think I will save the planet or is a joy to drive.

Plus it is very stupid in policy in Europe to force this green trend when most of the world and biggest polluters like China, India don't do anything. Even if in 10 years EU is carbon neutral and makes itself bankrupt in the process, the impact will be negligible overall..
Sorry for the ramble..

My point is this one, like the topic says, even if the prices of fuel doubles, for what ever reason, politics, oil production crisis, you can adapt, like it happened before. It is how Japan entered the US car market in 70's during the big Oil shock when OPEC was formed.

LOL, see you're talking about moving to a more affordable place, all the while suggesting we shouldn't be concerned about where we live getting more expensive for purely political purposes. And to be clear when I say "political purposes" here is how it is done in our government: A politician creates and imaginary urgent concern, he is joined in his or her imaginary urgent concern by other politicians. The media promotes his imaginary urgent concern as urgent, and they do it over and over and over. Then somebody establishes an organization or foundation to "combat the imaginary urgent concern" , but wait, to assuage this imaginary urgent concern through the foundation they need funding! So the politicians all gather 'round and give hundreds of millions of taxpayer dollars to the "foundation to combat imaginary urgent concerns" and frequently these foundations are offshore. The "foundations to combat imaginary urgent concerns" then gives a substantial percentage of the taxpayer dollars back to the politicians through their family members, shell companies,foundations,political campaign contributions, etc. basically just laundering the taxpayer dollar back to the politician. And when they run out of taxpayer dollars you know what they do? That's right, they BORROW anothe 53 cents of every dollar they spend, and sign the note "U.S.Taxpayer". For example, for decades they have borrowed money from China, AND THEN gave it right back to them in the form of "humanitarian and economic aid", while the taxpayer holds the note, and money flows right back into the politicians accounts.

"Climate change" is one of the (if not THE) preeminent "imaginary urgent concerns" in the world today, I mean who wouldn't want to save the Earth right? RIGHT? THEEEEE EEEEAAAARTH, RIIIIGHT? Meanwhile these same politicians, media talking heads, celebrities and self designated elites are jetting around the world in their private jets, to their multiple mansions and in between preaching about how bad the simple people are for the planet. The same people who believe that masks are going to save them from coronavirus believe that if they give politicians more money that they will save the planet.

"Two weeks to flatten the curve"
"What's a little more tax to save the planet"
"Don't be selfish"
"Just take the vaccine"

I remember when the Russians used to discuss Americans decadent lifestyle, and we would laugh and mock them but they were right. Americans have become lazy and complacent, so comfortable in their lifestyles that they won't even lift a finger to save themselves and their Republic.

You know how I know that?

There are no politicians hanging from the streetlights.


LOL, so, yeah, sorry but no, I'm not good with higher fuel costs.

 

[leeloo]

Frozen wind turbines and natural gas lines just happened in texas, so he's right about that. There's a number of ''narrative pushers'' out there with articles saying ''it ain't the green energy switch's fault.'' That's a sure sign, that it IS green energy's, and their kickback politicians, fault. When in doubt, the truth is the opposite of the ''narrative pushers'' nearly all the time.

The story behind Texas's rolling power blackouts as more are expected Tuesday

Record-breaking cold and generators going offline have led to electric power emergencies for millions of Texans.

www.kvue.com

A friend of mind has ''slush'' in his toilet. That's a new record cold for them.

frozen gas lines are just poor planing and cost cutting. In Siberia, one of the coldest region on Earth they transport gas in any whether just fine..
Also a lack of investment in the grid. Distribution of electricity was and is one of the most profitable bussiness on the planet no matter where you are..so now, that they need to invest to adapt they cry like little babies for subsidies or price hikes to consumers...

 

[bgenlvtex]

frozen gas lines are just poor planing and cost cutting. In Siberia, one of the coldest region on Earth they transport gas in any whether just fine..
Also a lack of investment in the grid. Distribution of electricity was and is one of the most profitable bussiness on the planet no matter where you are..so now, that they need to invest to adapt they cry like little babies for subsidies or price hikes to consumers...

"Frozen gas lines" is a bullshit story. They shut the power plants in to avoid the surging natural gas "spot" price saving the utilities hundreds of millions of dollars in profit.

ERCOT (Electric Reliability Council of Texas) passed an emergency order today allowing the utilities to pass those fuel costs to the consumers. basically they just held the citizens of Texas hostage during the worst freezing weather we have ever seen, until ERCOT allowed them to pass the additional expenses to the consumer.

 

[MidOH]

frozen gas lines are just poor planing and cost cutting. In Siberia, one of the coldest region on Earth they transport gas in any whether just fine..
Also a lack of investment in the grid. Distribution of electricity was and is one of the most profitable bussiness on the planet no matter where you are..so now, that they need to invest to adapt they cry like little babies for subsidies or price hikes to consumers...

It's actually the pressure regulators that freeze up. Not so much the lines. But the fuel itself can also get so cold that it's a pita to use.

No idea what the truth is in Texas, obviously. I'm nowhere near there.

 

[leeloo]

.

Electric of some sort is the future, but not until we make massive advancements in energy density per both size and weight. I'm all for investing in them to find the way but the frustration many of us here (in the US) feel with the activists is that banning pipelines and large engines and mandating economy standards doesn't instantly will the technology to replace these pieces into existence. The technology just isn't there yet to replace larger vehicles in specialized applications and as long as SUVs and trucks need to haul and tow, they are going to need the large engines.

You don't need a huge battery to go full electric x miles. You can have a hybrid system like in the Camry for example. It does not have huge weight, battery is very small a few kw . It saves a huge amount of fuel in certain conditions, when your vehicle is the least efficient. Hybrid systems like the ones used in toyota (not PHEV ) see the highest fuel economy exactly at low speeds and stop and go driving .. From this point of view, off road and heavy traffic city driving is similar - in both cases you drive slow, stop often, you break and accelerate a lot.. .etc..
I know it works . My car has 120 HP hybrid engine - automatic gearbox, small size, it does 50 mpg in city driving heavy traffic. . My previous car was normal petrol car, also 120hp automatic. In city traffic it had 25 mpg. In highway driving, they are almost the same. And I am not talking about the fuel economy in test conditions,, I had them both for years, both driven summer, winter etc.. and this was the trend I saw. This is why I am very optimistic about hybrid overlanding vehicles, either pickups or big SUV.
Right now with diesel, because of emissions I have to have adblue (DEF in US i think ) with me all the time. In international travel is a problem.


If you go to to Africa, Asia, South America.. You can order it in advance, you can carry some, I hear any Land Rover dealers in Asia and Africa have it, but still is a PITA. In addition to that, on my vehicle the adblue reservoir is completly unprotected, under the driver somewhere on the bottom of the car. If i hit it I am done, even if I have some spare fluid with me, engine goes in to limp mode at 50 % power.. . So I would take a hybrid any day over this. Even if want to buy a petrol pick up or Big SUV, in Europe they do not exist. There is no petrol pick up . All the good off road SUV's are Diesel . Here I am talking about Landcruiser Prado,Mitsubishi Pajero etc..
My hope is Hybrid technology...

 

[Sparksalot]

It's in negative temps in texas. The power has been out all night woke up to 27° in my house the water in my toilet is frozen solid , there is no propane to be found for miles and miles thanks to govonor Abbott, he ordered rolling blackout for no reason and didn't think to increase the lp supplies so It kind-of is gonna be political especially when people die from exposure in their own home due to his ignorance. This one event is gonna turn texas blue in the next election just to get rid of wheels.

If anyone in or near hunt County has some propane to spare I'll buy it for a bit more than it's worth.

The governor didn’t order this crap, ERCOT did.

 

[Correus]

LOL, see you're talking about moving to a more affordable place, all the while suggesting we shouldn't be concerned about where we live getting more expensive for purely political purposes. And to be clear when I say "political purposes" here is how it is done in our government: A politician creates and imaginary urgent concern, he is joined in his or her imaginary urgent concern by other politicians. The media promotes his imaginary urgent concern as urgent, and they do it over and over and over. Then somebody establishes an organization or foundation to "combat the imaginary urgent concern" , but wait, to assuage this imaginary urgent concern through the foundation they need funding! So the politicians all gather 'round and give hundreds of millions of taxpayer dollars to the "foundation to combat imaginary urgent concerns" and frequently these foundations are offshore. The "foundations to combat imaginary urgent concerns" then gives a substantial percentage of the taxpayer dollars back to the politicians through their family members, shell companies,foundations,political campaign contributions, etc. basically just laundering the taxpayer dollar back to the politician. And when they run out of taxpayer dollars you know what they do? That's right, they BORROW anothe 53 cents of every dollar they spend, and sign the note "U.S.Taxpayer". For example, for decades they have borrowed money from China, AND THEN gave it right back to them in the form of "humanitarian and economic aid", while the taxpayer holds the note, and money flows right back into the politicians accounts.

"Climate change" is one of the (if not THE) preeminent "imaginary urgent concerns" in the world today, I mean who wouldn't want to save the Earth right? RIGHT? THEEEEE EEEEAAAARTH, RIIIIGHT? Meanwhile these same politicians, media talking heads, celebrities and self designated elites are jetting around the world in their private jets, to their multiple mansions and in between preaching about how bad the simple people are for the planet. The same people who believe that masks are going to save them from coronavirus believe that if they give politicians more money that they will save the planet.

"Two weeks to flatten the curve"
"What's a little more tax to save the planet"
"Don't be selfish"
"Just take the vaccine"

I remember when the Russians used to discuss Americans decadent lifestyle, and we would laugh and mock them but they were right. Americans have become lazy and complacent, so comfortable in their lifestyles that they won't even lift a finger to save themselves and their Republic.

You know how I know that?

There are no politicians hanging from the streetlights.


LOL, so, yeah, sorry but no, I'm not good with higher fuel costs.

 

[BCMoto]

$3.91 for 91 in Ca today

 

[Jim SoG]

Ok folks, NO POLITICS. Got reports about the thread not following the OPs post. This thread is about Higher gas prices and would it make you change your overlanding, NOT POLITICS.

If you come back and the tread is locked, means somebody does not understand NO POLITICS.

Jim

 

[Alanymarce]

All the good off road SUV's are Diesel . Here I am talking about Landcruiser Prado,Mitsubishi Pajero etc..
My hope is Hybrid technology...

Depends where you are - our Montero (=Pajero=Shogun) has a petrol/gas V6. You can;t get one in Australia, it's true, but you can in Europe, South America, Middle East,... You can buy petrol LCs in many parts of the world too.

I agree that hybrid power is likely to be more practical in remote areas than full electric power, however like full electric more in principle. Who knows how far we can develop this with solar recharge (and wind in Wyoming, rain in Vancouver, and fog in St John's...)