Recovery gear ratings?

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Veinot

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The Hi-Lift Winch Kit is converting a hi-lift jack -- also known as a Farm Jack or a "Widowmaker Jack"l -- into a pulling tool. It's not the same as a come-along; a come-along uses internal gearing and pulley systems...
Now that I got a look at it I see what is going on; I have used high lift jacks with supervision and know they can be dangerous but never used them in that way; why wouldn't you use a come-along in this way? Is there a functional reason or just a weight saving one?
All of my recoveries have been either using what I could find to give traction or lever to increase my pushing power on a vehicle; or pull with another vehicle. I never had to use winches or come-alongs or high lift jacks for that. Since I moved 600km from my nearest buddy with a truck I was looking for a simple and budget friendly way to be a little more self sufficient because my off road exploration now days is me my wife kids and dog. None of which are particularly helpful when stuck lol.
My idea with the kinetic strap was that if it worked like an elastic then I should be able to use a come-along to stretch the strap storing energy into it to give me a nudge when I give the car some gas to get me out. If all I need is a nudge then traction pads would probably do.
 

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@Veinot “Is there a functional reason or just a weight saving one?”

the mechanical advantage of the high lift handle moves a lot more weight. A huge come-a-long is rated at 5,000 lbs, but I have broken many a come-a-long pulling vehicles out of sticky clay... never have I broken a high-lift in The same conditions... that said, neither replaces a winch.
 
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Veinot

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that said, neither replaces a winch.
Yeah but I have no place to mount one. I did find a front hitch mount for a Ridgeline but it is only rated at 350lbs tongue weight and 3500lbs trailer weight; not sure if that can support the pulling force of a winch. The other issue is that the designs I seen will lower my front clearance by about an inch. My rear hitch is rated for 500lbs and 5000lbs.
Getting into things that are likely cost prohibitive; I figured I could mock up a design of a front bush guard/push bar that mounts using the front hitch mount points and the "screw in" recovery points in the front bumper. I thought that might give enough support and purchase to mount a winch but I cannot find much info on what those recovery posts can take.
I know there are a number of front guard/bumpers but all the ones I seen mount to 6 bolt locations under the front (same locations the front hitch looks to mount too) and some dinky looking bolts above the headlights under the hood. They look good but I fear they are only for looks and again no info on what forces they are designed to take.
Anyway I think I have gotten off topic a bit, I think for the near future kinetic strap and traction pads. Then look into a High-lift jack recovery kit and jack. I doubt I will "need" more than that.
What I really need is some local buddies but I don't think overlanding is a big thing here; there are lots of back roads to explore and travel but no places to boondock/dry/free camp at all. You might find a hidden beach that few can get too with a typical car.
 

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Now that I got a look at it I see what is going on; I have used high lift jacks with supervision and know they can be dangerous but never used them in that way; why wouldn't you use a come-along in this way? Is there a functional reason or just a weight saving one?
All of my recoveries have been either using what I could find to give traction or lever to increase my pushing power on a vehicle; or pull with another vehicle. I never had to use winches or come-alongs or high lift jacks for that. Since I moved 600km from my nearest buddy with a truck I was looking for a simple and budget friendly way to be a little more self sufficient because my off road exploration now days is me my wife kids and dog. None of which are particularly helpful when stuck lol.
My idea with the kinetic strap was that if it worked like an elastic then I should be able to use a come-along to stretch the strap storing energy into it to give me a nudge when I give the car some gas to get me out. If all I need is a nudge then traction pads would probably do.
I think the main reason the hi-lift has notoriety this use is that often people already had them handy for tire changes etc. So rather than bring two tools (jack and a come along) the tool that served both purposes won out.

Your idea of using the kinetic rope to store energy might work. I’m not familiar with anyone using that approach though as the moment you need more energy than the rope can store, you are stuck, which is not true for a static rope that exerts a pulling force that actually moves the vehicle once the slack is off.

Remember though you don’t need a lot of this stuff unless going fairly remote solo or tacking tough trails. If this is a “just in case” plan then the traction boards and kinetic rope should be plenty — worst case if the boards don’t work the kinetic rope is what you’ll need for a passer by to get you out.
 
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Veinot

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Remember though you don’t need a lot of this stuff unless going fairly remote solo or tacking tough trails. If this is a “just in case” plan then the traction boards and kinetic rope should be plenty — worst case if the boards don’t work the kinetic rope is what you’ll need for a passer by to get you out.
Yeah I think that is likely the best approach, most of my exploring is fire roads and resource roads where my obstacles generally require a chain saw more so than a winch. Because I have been pushing it a bit now that I have an SUV the idea of carrying more equipment has been on my mind; since I am usually alone (as in only one vehicle). If I was part of a group I would be a bit more brazen.
 

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Putting the Winch size aside, You should have 1 or 2 snatch blocks in your kit. WHY,.....because at some point you will need to use the winch in a less than ideal positional recovery. You won't have a straight shot to a anchor point, but instead be at a angle. This will cause the winch drum to wrap all the cable/rope on one side, causing either a JAM...or....a MESS. Using a snatch block or a shackle creating a shallow 'V', will help keep the cable more straight as it wraps.

Before I got my winch, I was involved in a recovery where I was one of 2 anchor points. THE SCENARIO,,,,,,, A Jeep with a trailer, needed to get out of a very steep hollow, with a sharp 90 degree turn half way up. Because of that, he could not just attach his winch line up above. The very steep climb,+ the turn, ensured that he would have to stop half way up (needed 2/3's the way for traction purposes) and redirect the line. The ground was slippery and somewhat wet (no traction), meaning he would slide uncontrollably to the bottom. What we did was create a directed pull, that would get him up far enough to hold the jeep/trailer while giving him a solid anchor on the road above (Me), and to one side(my trucks recovery hooks. By the way if he had had synthetic line, it might not have worked out, as the winch line even being directed, still was in the dirt in the middle 90 degree turn area. I had to use a 30 foot static web strap line as a long tree saver with a Clevis (pre winch/pre snatch blocks), with his cable being directed thru it to my trucks recovery hooks. This was a time before synthetic line became more common, and before the advent of soft shackles (safer) I grabbed blankets/jackets etc as line dampers in case of a problem. Made sure everyone was far back, and even being safety aware, I still had to remind some to stand further back, Something you would think would go without saying.

Everything worked out okay, and now years later, it is nice to have gear more attuned to safety, then was available at the time. Soft shackles are a big game changer. They allow for a wider range of options than just using metal clevis shackles. I would say that on these, bigger is way better than a smaller rating both for wear and safety IMO.
 

MidOH

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I would never use a come along for this. Get a Hilift or electric winch.

Generally, you don't want to be standing next to a metal cable when it snaps. I use 35' of chain with the Hilift. I also have some synthetic winch rope.
 
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smlobx

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Chain should NEVER be used in any recovery situation. Period, end of discussion.
 

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Chain should NEVER be used in any recovery situation. Period, end of discussion.

If I can ask you to re-open the discussion just for a bit, can you expand on why you feel chains should not be used in a recovery situation?
 

MidOH

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Yeah, because that doesn't sound right. Been using chains responsibly for 30 years.

Overloaded steel cables are the widowmakers you might be thinking of.
 

smlobx

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OK guys.
I’m really surprised how many of you think a chain is the answer.
A quick search came up with this article..


Have I used a chain before ...yes I have. I owned a construction company for 37 years and have pulled equipment that was stuck that weighed over 30 tons. In fact I had a cable that was rated over 100,000 (50 tons) and used it probably monthly. But after my first heavy duty chain snapped I researched what to use so that my guys wouldn’t kill themselves and we switched over to heavy nylon straps. In fact my concrete company switched several years ago when one of their employees was injured. I also carry a kinetic rope which allows me to recover vehicles easier and potentially larger than what I’m driving. If you have never seen Matt’s off-road recovery Utube channel check him out. I think you’ll become a believer..

The bottom line is that while a chain might work it also might severely injure you...there are better, lighter and cheaper options for snatching a 3 to 5 ton vehicle out of the mud.
 

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OK guys.
I’m really surprised how many of you think a chain is the answer.
A quick search came up with this article..


Have I used a chain before ...yes I have. I owned a construction company for 37 years and have pulled equipment that was stuck that weighed over 30 tons. In fact I had a cable that was rated over 100,000 (50 tons) and used it probably monthly. But after my first heavy duty chain snapped I researched what to use so that my guys wouldn’t kill themselves and we switched over to heavy nylon straps. In fact my concrete company switched several years ago when one of their employees was injured. I also carry a kinetic rope which allows me to recover vehicles easier and potentially larger than what I’m driving. If you have never seen Matt’s off-road recovery Utube channel check him out. I think you’ll become a believer..

The bottom line is that while a chain might work it also might severely injure you...there are better, lighter and cheaper options for snatching a 3 to 5 ton vehicle out of the mud.
Well according to that article, my 9/16” grade 100 chain is double the strength of the pull of my winch with the same sized cable, of corse you don’t use open hooks with chain; who is that dumb? Also you don’t go jerking on a rig while using chain, you ease into the pull to take up slack... btw, don’t you dare jerk me and my rig while pulling me out even with a kinetic strap or you’re going to have a busted jaw (just ask Nate). I would agree with that article for someone who knows nothing about chains and gets a Walmart recovery chain.
 
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I no more think "a chain is the answer" than I think "Chain should NEVER be used in any recovery situation."
I never we said it was the answer, but I won’t leave my chain behind either... like I said, never broke a chain not had it come unhooked in over 30 years of using them, but I have broken way too many straps and ropes to count... I also know how to read a situation to know which to grab... chains are usually a last resort unless using my hi-lift jack, or making a yoke for my winch.
 
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smlobx

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Well according to that article, my 9/16” grade 10 chain is double the strength of the pull of my winch with the same sized cable, of corse you don’t use open hooks with chain; who is that dumb? Also you don’t go jerking on a rig while using chain, you ease into the pull to take up slack... btw, don’t you dare jerk me and my rig while pulling me out even with a kinetic strap or you’re going to have a busted jaw (just ask Nate). I would agree with that article for someone who knows nothing about chains and gets a Walmart recovery chain.
Mike I’ve never heard of a Grade 10 chain...Are you sure?? Most chain grades start at 30 and go up from there.
 

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Mike I’ve never heard of a Grade 10 chain...Are you sure?? Most chain grades start at 30 and go up from there.
Typo, thanks for catching that... Grade 100... I will go fix my previous post to reflect my typo
 

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Good. How long is your chain and how much does that beast weigh?
I have a 10’ chain and a 15’ chain... how much does it weigh??? Not sure never weighed it... and since I run Full Sized 1/2 Ton or larger rigs, I really never cared...