Overlanding with "stock" 4X4

[Lanlubber In Remembrance]

I would be curious to see if it's actually the Eaton Gov. Lock or a clutch style possi based on what the rig was intended to be used for. That said I have done tons of wheeling with Gov. Locks and not had problems, you just need to know they don't like full throttle so just don't mat it and you'll be fine.

For sure I'm a creeper with only enough speed for the momentum I need. Driving skills are 99%, the rest is equipment. IMO !

 

[Billiebob]

Shortly after buying our JK we took an offroading class. He kept stressing how "capable" our vehicle was as-is and then proceeded to prove it to us through the experiences of the class. Bottom line, without changing a thing we were able to do a whole lot...more than I ever would have guessed.

Think most people underestimate what their stock vehicle can do and overestimate what they actually intend to do with it. Most of the mods I have done have been for either safety or to just learn more about my vehicle by turning a few wrenches. It is an enjoyable experience making it unique and our own.

100% but I don't think it is just under estimating how good a stock vehicle is, it is watching too much advertising. listening to too much hype.. even on this forum and falling into the need for acceptance by the rest of those falling for the hype and needing reassurance they made the right choice.

It is not that they over estimate what they will really do..... it is needing people to believe they are doing more.

 

[Downs]

I would be curious to see if it's actually the Eaton Gov. Lock or a clutch style possi based on what the rig was intended to be used for. That said I have done tons of wheeling with Gov. Locks and not had problems, you just need to know they don't like full throttle so just don't mat it and you'll be fine.

It is not a limited slip. It is a locker.

 

[Sparksalot]

I would be curious to see if it's actually the Eaton Gov. Lock or a clutch style possi based on what the rig was intended to be used for. That said I have done tons of wheeling with Gov. Locks and not had problems, you just need to know they don't like full throttle so just don't mat it and you'll be fine.

It is the Eaton unit.

 

[Sparksalot]

Hey guy's, I use my roof rack for more than just overlanding or travel. I have a heavy duty one (loads up to 800#) that I can put a sheet of plywood on and a couple of chairs and watch outdoor events above everybody else, events like 4th of July displays, off road racing, mud bog spectating , tractor pulls, Rodeo's etc., so don't be knocking the roof rack. It also hauls my building materials and other things. :- )

That’s cool!

 

[RZFZJ80]

Do you need all the gear? Absolutely not. Is it fun to mod your rig? Absolutely. Most people also love the way it looks and there’s no shame in that.

 

[Lanlubber In Remembrance]

That’s cool!

I think so. It was built in Africa and used on safaris for hunting. I think I stole it @ $400 from the man who had it made and brought back to the US. He was a government Diplomat, and still is but sold the LRD2 that he brought back go the states. Could easily throw a pup tent and mattress up there if need be.

 

[Dilldog]

It is not a limited slip. It is a locker.

Yeah I know the G80 RPO code is for the Eaton Gov Lock, but I was thinking it might have a limited slip due to the " street performance" build of the police package. Shortly after posting that I thought, no it would be different code for a limited slip, duh.

 

[Boostpowered]

This whole modifying til it break comes from the bro truck world where you jack your truck up to the sky ie over 6 inches of lift and too big of tires, if your building a monster truck yeah your going to break cv joints, bearings, bushings etc thats the price you have to pay. Then you wise up and put military axles under your truck and no more blown parts.

 

[MidOH]

[Says the guy with a snorkel. Lol.]

The g80 diff takes too long to kick in. It'll tear the top layer of grass up and I'll be down to slick clay mud. Once stuck in that super slick mud, the throttle needed will shred the g80. Been there, done that. I'd replace it asap if you see similar conditions often. But it's better than nothing. A real locker can prevent tearing ruts everywhere.

 

[Boostpowered]

[Says the guy with a snorkel. Lol.]

The g80 diff takes too long to kick in. It'll tear the top layer of grass up and I'll be down to slick clay mud. Once stuck in that super slick mud, the throttle needed will shred the g80. Been there, done that. I'd replace it asap if you see similar conditions often. But it's better than nothing. A real locker can prevent tearing ruts everywhere.

Ive not noticed the g80 slip under low rpm maybe once when i still had a/t tires but they locked up smooth. Im still waiting for a zr2 to hit the junkyard so i can pull the front diff for a front electronic locker.

And on snorkle thats just insurance if i knew how many folks would just walk up and talk to me about it at gas stations id have rethunk it, the snorkle was the product of a few bridges in my area failing after floods leaving no way home except through the creek and someone hit my passenger side fender in parking lot so no reason not to cut a 4 inch hole in my fender. All the mods ive done arent to get into the absolute roughest stuff i can find they are all to make sure if i do get into it i can also get out and back home. A 3 inch lift and a couple size larger tires isnt going to kill your suspension if youve done it right ie: if you lift the suspension and you have an ifs vehicle you also need to drop the diff and drop the sway bar if you dont then yes your gonna tear up your cv shafts. The key is to do it right.

 

[Anak]

This whole modifying til it break comes from the bro truck world where you jack your truck up to the sky ie over 6 inches of lift and too big of tires, if your building a monster truck yeah your going to break cv joints, bearings, bushings etc thats the price you have to pay. Then you wise up and put military axles under your truck and no more blown parts.

This is indeed the source of the problem. Guys want the style, but aren't willing to back it up with the substance.

It is certainly feasible to go big and to have reliability, but you have to go big all the way through the vehicle. This means axles with larger axle shafts and larger brakes, larger diameter driveshafts with larger U-joints, transfer cases with wider chains or no chains at all... the list could go on and on. How big you want to go dictates how far you have to go with the modifications.

I think one of the roots of the problem is that there are two distinct camps, yet the observers lump all of them in one group. Those who want the style but aren't willing to back it up make the whole picture look bad. Yet there are those who build these types of vehicles well and use them successfully. Lamentably, many people can't distinguish the difference.

The story behind Hooker Headers comes to mind. Gary Hooker was a successful drag racer in the early/mid '60s. He was at a track when a factory sponsored car was present and being dyno tested. The factory car and his were very similar and so he was invited to put his car on the dyno so they could see how the two compared. Gary's car turned out better numbers. So the factory sponsored crowd took a look at what was different about his car and what they could see were the headers. They told Gary they wanted a set of those, and that was the start of Hooker Headers. The thing is, they could not see all the internal tuning Gary had done on that engine, things like running without head gaskets. They latched onto the immediately obvious, external difference and decided that was the factor that mattered. The truth is that was but the tip of an iceberg.

It is much the same with building a rig. A lift and tires is just one element in a larger picture. If you want to make that immediately visible change then you need to be prepared to make the rest of the necessary changes too. And it is plenty viable. You don't have to be a rocket scientist to put together a working package. But you can't be lazy and cheap about it. Go into it with your eyes open, do some research and invest the time and money and you can have results to be proud of.

 

[Dilldog]

Ive not noticed the g80 slip under low rpm maybe once when i still had a/t tires but they locked up smooth. Im still waiting for a zr2 to hit the junkyard so i can pull the front diff for a front electronic locker.

And on snorkle thats just insurance if i knew how many folks would just walk up and talk to me about it at gas stations id have rethunk it, the snorkle was the product of a few bridges in my area failing after floods leaving no way home except through the creek and someone hit my passenger side fender in parking lot so no reason not to cut a 4 inch hole in my fender. All the mods ive done arent to get into the absolute roughest stuff i can find they are all to make sure if i do get into it i can also get out and back home. A 3 inch lift and a couple size larger tires isnt going to kill your suspension if youve done it right ie: if you lift the suspension and you have an ifs vehicle you also need to drop the diff and drop the sway bar if you dont then yes your gonna tear up your cv shafts. The key is to do it right.

The issue with the Gov Lock is that it requires 150rpm ( or something close to that, can't remember the exact speed) differential between the two wheels on the axle before a set of fly weights engage the locking elements. They actually work better and longer with steady throttle and lower engine speeds, so Boosted you're doing it right which is why you don't have issues. People who just floor it and keep the pedal down are the ones who have issues.

 

[Billiebob]

Getting back on topic, can you overland with a stock 4x4 ?

YES !! Definitely and you will have a vehicle which benefits from factory research and development..... and warranty.

Once you start modifying a 4x4 you open a pandoras box. For overlanders as opposed to rock crawlers, mud boggers, trophy trucks, reliability and range are the most important criteria. So first choice is to pick the vehicle capable of carrying what you need. And outfit it to not exceed the GVWR. And since most of us are funding challenged, spend the money on travel, rather than shop time.

There is nothing more reliable than a box stock, well maintained factory 4x4.

 

[Smileyshaun]

The issue with the Gov Lock is that it requires 150rpm ( or something close to that, can't remember the exact speed) differential between the two wheels on the axle before a set of fly weights engage the locking elements. They actually work better and longer with steady throttle and lower engine speeds, so Boosted you're doing it right which is why you don't have issues. People who just floor it and keep the pedal down are the ones who have issues.

One of the biggest issues with the g80 is it unlocks at i think 3200 rpm , so when you do a full throttle wheel spin it unlocks and then locks back in under some speed and that’s usually when it explodes .

 

[Lanlubber In Remembrance]

This is indeed the source of the problem. Guys want the style, but aren't willing to back it up with the substance.

It is certainly feasible to go big and to have reliability, but you have to go big all the way through the vehicle. This means axles with larger axle shafts and larger brakes, larger diameter driveshafts with larger U-joints, transfer cases with wider chains or no chains at all... the list could go on and on. How big you want to go dictates how far you have to go with the modifications.

I think one of the roots of the problem is that there are two distinct camps, yet the observers lump all of them in one group. Those who want the style but aren't willing to back it up make the whole picture look bad. Yet there are those who build these types of vehicles well and use them successfully. Lamentably, many people can't distinguish the difference.

The story behind Hooker Headers comes to mind. Gary Hooker was a successful drag racer in the early/mid '60s. He was at a track when a factory sponsored car was present and being dyno tested. The factory car and his were very similar and so he was invited to put his car on the dyno so they could see how the two compared. Gary's car turned out better numbers. So the factory sponsored crowd took a look at what was different about his car and what they could see were the headers. They told Gary they wanted a set of those, and that was the start of Hooker Headers. The thing is, they could not see all the internal tuning Gary had done on that engine, things like running without head gaskets. They latched onto the immediately obvious, external difference and decided that was the factor that mattered. The truth is that was but the tip of an iceberg.

It is much the same with building a rig. A lift and tires is just one element in a larger picture. If you want to make that immediately visible change then you need to be prepared to make the rest of the necessary changes too. And it is plenty viable. You don't have to be a rocket scientist to put together a working package. But you can't be lazy and cheap about it. Go into it with your eyes open, do some research and invest the time and money and you can have results to be proud of.

An old race car builder and driver agrees with you completely. Performance is not cheap and dosent come from appearances. Unless you have money to burn, do all things in modesty !

Getting back on topic, can you overland with a stock 4x4 ?

YES !! Definitely and you will have a vehicle which benefits from factory research and development..... and warranty.

Once you start modifying a 4x4 you open a pandoras box. For overlanders as opposed to rock crawlers, mud boggers, trophy trucks, reliability and range are the most important criteria. So first choice is to pick the vehicle capable of carrying what you need. And outfit it to not exceed the GVWR. And since most of us are funding challenged, spend the money on travel, rather than shop time.

There is nothing more reliable than a box stock, well maintained factory 4x4.

As long as you stay within the bounds of factory engineering, few will do that. It's human nature to take it up a notch or two.

 

[Wile_Coyote]

How about some discussion, or a YouTube, about overlanding in a stock 4X4? Seems most info is about mod rigs as if to say one can't go overlanding to adventure in a stock vehicle. It seems that the manufacturers of 4X4's wouldn't agree given that they have invested no small amount of effort in R&D and they outfit with suspensions, drives, AT tires (etc) and market specifically claiming that capability. What are the realities of overlanding in a stock 4X4? What are the capabilities and restrictions associated with "stock"? Why do you say that larger tires and lifts are "required"? Does adventure require investments into a modified rig? I'm an old sailor and we had the expression that "paradise looks the same regardless of the size of the cockpit".

I think it depends on which stock vehicle we are talking about.
Tacoma; in stock format, the TRD models have good ground clearance and generally do not have running boards, and are ready to do some exploring.
4Runner; generally not ready
Silverado; most have running boards, street tires, and are geared for street running and towing
F150; same as the Silverado
Raptor; bring it!
Ram PowerWagon; Bring it!
Subaru; street tires, which are not really ready for rocks and sticks
Jeep; if you want to pay through the nose for a diff locked jeep, then, I suppose it's ready.

Most trucks and SUVs have 31.5" tires, which when aired down really drop the clearance of any vehicle.
Of the more affordable vehicles, I think the Tacoma is the most trail ready

 

[M Rose]

What do you guys consider stock? My wife's Focus isn't even stock, it has a rewound starter and alternator to exceed stock oem standards because replacing every 3 years is a joke.

 

[Billiebob]

What do you guys consider stock? My wife's Focus isn't even stock, it has a rewound starter and alternator to exceed stock oem standards because replacing every 3 years is a joke.

I'd call stock staying within the OEM spec with basic bolt on parts. Run winter tires, stock size in the winter, same thing. Change springs and shocks to an after market supplier but within the stock spec, you are still stock. Maintenance is not modifying even if the parts promise better performance.

Change to all LED lighting, you have likely reduced the load on the battery, probably could be considered a mod but one of the few mods which actually increase the ability of the battery, alternator to supply that ARB Cooler/Fridge/Freezer. Very few mods actually increase the payload capacity or improve the fuel economy to extend the vehicles range. Most mods add stress to the associated stock components.

Add a supercharger, lift the suspension and grow the tires 5", pull the factory bumpers and add 50# of steel with a winch and swing out tire carrier, no longer stock. You have either made significant changes which will affect the performance, reliability of every other component or you have reduced the payload capacity by 50#.

 

[M Rose]

I'd call stock staying within the OEM spec with basic bolt on parts. Run winter tires, stock size in the winter, same thing. Change springs and shocks to an after market supplier but within the stock spec, you are still stock. Maintenance is not modifying.

Change to all LED lighting, you have likely reduced the load on the battery, probably could be considered a mod but one of the few mods which actually increase the ability of the battery, alternator to supply that ARB Cooler'Fridge/Freezer. Very few mods actually increase the payload capacity or improve the fuel economy to extend the vehicles range. Most mods add stress to the associated stock components.

Add a supercharger, lift the suspension and grow the tires 5", pull the factory bumpers and add 50# of steel with a winch and swing out tire carrier, no longer stock. You have either made significant changes which will affect the performance, reliability of every other component or you have reduced the payload capacity by 50#.

If the part isn't factory oem in most cases it voids the factory warranty. Case in point. 2002-2005 Jeep Wranglers with the 4.0 and 6 speed transmission had a recall for the ignition system. At about 50-75,000 miles the bronze distributor drive gear would fail. Chrysler's fix was a new aluminum drive gear. The "new" gear introduces aluminum into the oil as it wears taking out the camshaft bearings. There realy is only one fix for this problem, an aftermarket camshaft with harden steel gears, an Aftermarket distributor with bearings and hardened steel drive gear, along with an aftermarket timing set. All of these parts voided the manufacturer waranty. Wich I needed because the aluminum particles also took out the rod bearings prematurely. All the aftermarket parts I put in exeeded minimum stock specs, but weren't Cyrsler parts so voided the waranty. All parts were put in at the local dealership, by a "certified" Jeep mechanic.
I could have done the work myself and saved a ton of money as at the time, I had several ASE Certificates, one being Engine diagnostic and repair.
So even if a part meets and/or exceeds manufacturer specs, doesn't mean its still stock.