The kind of thing we must help stop.

[MOAK]

I stumbled upon this vid many years ago while planning our first trip out to The Needles District. There are a couple of things very wrong here. Not the least of which is the fact that there are big signs at each end of this switchback that clearly state,,, PULL IN BACK DOWN on one end, and on the other end of it, PULL IN BACK UP. Many have seen my video on the proper way to navigate this section. Guys,, lemme tell ya, Del Albright and many many others, too numerous to mention are working very hard with our donated dollars to keep the two track trails open for us, our children and our grandchildren and many generations to come. This douche bag, and others like him, will simply bury decades of lobbying work under the ashpile, and our trails will be closed because the bad examples will be used against us.. If this dude can't back a trailer up, then he shouldn't be pulling it. There is no excuse. I also noticed that he hasn't replied to my comment, (aka rubicondon04) The second thing that is wrong is quite subjective. That rig is way overbuilt. Look how he jostles around so much at the very tiniest of off camber crossing.. Just not a good overlanding rig.. Sorry to vent, this has bothered me for quite some time....

 

[TreXTerra]

If I was planning on doing a trail like that with a trailer, I would add a tow hitch to my front bumper. That was I could pull in, unhitch the trailer, back part way up, hitch the trailer to the front bumper and pull it up backwards.

Actually, maybe I need to add that feature to my next front bumper...

 

[expeditionnorth]

calling folks names kind of ruined reading any further for me no matter how valid your point may be

even the guy with the lowest score at the end of the day they call doctor

seems like your venting more than making a legit argument in ways

 

[ExploreDesert]

Excuse my ignorance as I've never encountered a trail or signage like that, but what exactly is the issue?

 

[TreXTerra]

The trail is very narrow and steep which is why you need to pull forward and reverse down/up that section (I've driven this trail many times). By trying to turn around with a trailer, the driver technically drove off the trail, this is going to result in significant washout and erosion problems and damages the delicate cryptobiotic soil that stabilizes the desert landscape.

 

[Matt_Whitman]

Overbuilt or under built isn't what makes an overland rig. It's how you use your equipment and enjoy nature. You can say my truck is way over built but it is extremely capable and that translates into little to no wheel spin tearing up terrain. I also don't worry about bashing an oil pan leaking fluids all over the trail. Now if a sign says to pull in and back out that's what I'd do.

 

[sfsmedic]

So I don't pull a trailer. I didn't see him go off trail, I saw him make a 47 point turn to get around the corner. Can someone
explain what he did wrong because I don't see it.

 

[VCeXpedition]

@sfsmedic, see @TreXTerra comments, I think that's the point. This is a heavily used trail, it has lots of unnatural repairs using concrete and asphalt. Not sure I'm so upset about his rig being "overbuilt", but that Austin Power's turn is awesome.

 

[sfsmedic]

@sfsmedic, see @TreXTerra comments, I think that's the point. This is a heavily used trail, it has lots of unnatural repairs using concrete and asphalt. Not sure I'm so upset about his rig being "overbuilt", but that Austin Power's turn is awesome.

I did read it. I didn't see where he went off the trail in this video.

 

[vicali]

Looks like someone needs more practice with a trailer, but they made it eventually.
Although I would suggest maybe starting in an empty parking lot and working your way up to the trail once you know your limits better.

 

[MOAK]

It is difficult to actually "see it" in the video, but he did take a short cut, up and over an area that we shouldn't be going up and over.. The Salt Creek Trail in the Needles District has been permanently closed due to behavior such as this. Fortunately, back in 2010 we did get to travel a part of that trail, camp there, then hike back in to see the "12 Faces" and a few other remarkable artifacts. All being responsible takes is a willingness to learn, and to obey very simple instructions. As far as name calling? Sorry bout that, but when I personally encounter some one in our backcounties doing something, that may result in a two track trail closure, I've been known to respond with a lot worse things than name calling. Sometimes it isn't easy to get the correct "line" with a trailer, but we all must make the effort to do the right thing. It isn't rocket science to know that if we don't police one another some one else will. In the meantime, I'll continue to attempt to shame people into doing the right thing when out and about.

 

[shoredreamer]

I think a big factor about the OPs reaction is that Elephant Hill is a real 4wd trail, in a National Park! (Canyonlands) Mind blown?!? It's a gem. Not just a fire road with some rocky sections but more or less technical rock crawling that reaches remote campgrounds only accessible by modified 4wd, foot, or bicycle. Those campgrounds are nestled in the heart of the Needles district and E Hill is a key trail connection to more remote national forest areas. It is arguably one of the great difficult trails in Utah.

Know your skills, respect the trail, and have fun! It starts with just one. He might not have done any damage to the trail, but posting on YouTube makes it public, then down the line others see it and the reverse switchback becomes the 47 point turn switchback with guys with trailers. It's actually fun and challenging having to back up and down that turn, it's sort of a challenge and the video shows the "easy" way out.

 

[MOAK]

I think a big factor about the OPs reaction is that Elephant Hill is a real 4wd trail, in a National Park! (Canyonlands) Mind blown?!? It's a gem. Not just a fire road with some rocky sections but more or less technical rock crawling that reaches remote campgrounds only accessible by modified 4wd, foot, or bicycle. Those campgrounds are nestled in the heart of the Needles district and E Hill is a key trail connection to more remote national forest areas. It is arguably one of the great difficult trails in Utah.

Know your skills, respect the trail, and have fun! It starts with just one. He might not have done any damage to the trail, but posting on YouTube makes it public, then down the line others see it and the reverse switchback becomes the 47 point turn switchback with guys with trailers. It's actually fun and challenging having to back up and down that turn, it's sort of a challenge and the video shows the "easy" way out.

Thank you. I was hoping folks would do a bit of research to see just where the trail is, and the significance of it. My wife and I have camped at Devils Kitchen 3 times, and Horsehoof twice, then went out the bottom through Bobbies Hole, etc etc. There are well funded groups that want to see all the trails in the 4 corners region closed down. We, ( overlanders ) as a group must do everything we can to prevent that from happening, namely, Tread Lightly, Carry in Carry Out, and donate a couple extra bucks to the Blue Ribbon coalition, or look into the United Four Wheel Drive Association, but most importantly, don't give any of the trail closure folks any more ammunition than they already have by doing things out there that are completely moronic..... whew,,, I got through that without name calling..

 

[MOAK]

calling folks names kind of ruined reading any further for me no matter how valid your point may be

even the guy with the lowest score at the end of the day they call doctor

seems like your venting more than making a legit argument in ways

Sorry for the name calling, you are correct. I got a bit excited as I typed. How about, " a person engaged in moronic behaviour" or a "person engaged in the act of douche baggery?" Sorry, but if you can't laugh, all is lost..

 

[Mad Garden Gnome]

Overbuilt or under built isn't what makes an overland rig. It's how you use your equipment and enjoy nature. You can say my truck is way over built but it is extremely capable and that translates into little to no wheel spin tearing up terrain. I also don't worry about bashing an oil pan leaking fluids all over the trail. Now if a sign says to pull in and back out that's what I'd do.

This.

 

[Bob]

This.

I agree we need to obey the sign, I have been up this trail a few times, and having to back up to the next switchback is part of the fun.
This is certainly not one of the toughest trails in Utah as the park literature states though.

 

[1Louder]

Sounds like the simple solution would be to not allow trailers on that trail. I haven't been on it so I can't comment on how difficult it would be to back a trailer all the way up that section or at what point you would be able to legally turn around.

 

[mmnorthdirections]

Just a side note. He may have done this much easier with a receiver hitch on the front of the vehicle, isn't that why they make them.
It would in my opinion be worth a shot to push it and then the trail turns don't have to be driven over.
Also larger tires can greatly impact turn radius.

 

[MOAK]

Sounds like the simple solution would be to not allow trailers on that trail. I haven't been on it so I can't comment on how difficult it would be to back a trailer all the way up that section or at what point you would be able to legally turn around.

The back up/back down, depending on which direction you are going is a less than 100 yards. It is a very straight and wide easy back up exercise. Anything over 21 feet is prohibited. Before I go, I always check with a Ranger and let them know that I am at 22 feet, and how I plan on negotiating the switchback in question. It may be a little work, I've posted this before, but it is one proper way to do it. Another way would be to unhook the trailer and jostle it into position.

 

[Ranger]

When I started driving at 15, the first thing I wanted to do was take my dad's boat to the lake. He made me back the trailer around the neighborhood, until I could do it flawlessly. It takes practice. Getting that practice before being in a high consequence situation, is on the owner.