Communications for the Beginner

[Graeman]

I like using the 102" antenna, but you do have to be careful if you are the spotter when going over tough obstacles as the whip will attack you and that stainless steel whip will smack you and then you start to lose people wanting to be your spotter. Lol

 

[Graeman]

Communications for the Beginner? I think i'm even more confused than before I started reading these threads. I would consider myself proper beginner. I've never used any form of Radio Communications other than the stuff I used when I was in the Navy. I have been considering CB for my Land Rover and I think I've found the one but it comes as a package. I'm now torn between the 2 aerials. The pack is from Thunderpole and the 2 options are a Thunderpole Orbiter (1.55m) with a range of 5-10 miles and the second is a Thunderpole Mini Orbiter (0.89m) with a range of 3-5 miles. obviously the second option is cheaper but has anyone got any recommendations on which I should opt for?

Incidentally the CB is a TTI 881 although I may be swayed by the Thunderpole T2000

Boy, that is a good looking radio. The 900 has a front mounted speaker which is nice. Depending on where you plan on mounting the radio, having a front speaker, bottom speaker or buying an external speaker are things to think about. The tank whip looks to give the furthest range and should be the most durable.

 

[Graeman]

I think there is too much repetition throughout the forums so I don't want to add to it. I'll keep my eyes peeled for UK responses on here

I agree with Defender 90 Keith, as this question and the information being given is for all to read. If we start segregating every subject due to location it will make for more bandwidth being used and less people following the threads an din turn less subject getting answered with the shared knowledge of every one in the OB community. This site was made for all Overland Bound members not just the locals.

 

[TerryD]

I agree with Defender 90 Keith, as this question and the information being given is for all to read. If we start segregating every subject due to location it will make for more bandwidth being used and less people following the threads an din turn less subject getting answered with the shared knowledge of every one in the OB community. This site was made for all Overland Bound members not just the locals.

I was just suggesting that the titles of threads like this should be "What do I need to know about comms in the UK?" vs generic titles like "what do I need to know about comms?" There is a lot of good info, but we also have half a dozen beginner comms threads and I know nothing of comms in Japan, the EU or the UK so when I saw the thread pop up on my phone where the user's location might not be shown, I might wind up reccomending a bunch of gear that isn't available, or even LEGAL, in that country. That was my only reason for the suggestion. Just offering a bit of classification without creating more forums by adding more descriptive titles to threads.

Another example would be "what tires for the desert?" as opposed to "what tires do you like?" that we've seen a few times in the last few months as separate threads.

 

[TerryD]

I like using the 102" antenna, but you do have to be careful if you are the spotter when going over tough obstacles as the whip will attack you and that stainless steel whip will smack you and then you start to lose people wanting to be your spotter. Lol

The 102" on my K5 has hit people in the back seat on the trail and left welts. I will not run the spring with one again, I'll use a 6" spacer the way I did on my XJ.

 

[Defender 90 Keith]

I appreciate all the comments so far. my main question about the 2 options of aerial was to establish which was going to be the better option for me. Should I opt for the shorter one or the longer one?

the links to the 2 radios that I'm considering are:

http://www.thunderpole.co.uk/cb-radio-packs/thunderpole-cb-radio-executive-pack-tti-881.html

http://www.thunderpole.co.uk/cb-radio-packs/thunderpole-cb-radio-continental-pack-thunderpole-t-2000.html

 

[Graeman]

I guess that the only thing that really decides which antenna to buy is how far range do you want to get out? Longer will always have a better range. In the UK, you probably keep in a tighter group during excursions so a short antenna should work just fine. Here in the Southwest US, we tend to spread out further away from each other because of the extreme dust kicked up by each vehicle.

 

[Defender 90 Keith]

I guess that the only thing that really decides which antenna to buy is how far range do you want to get out? Longer will always have a better range. In the UK, you probably keep in a tighter group during excursions so a short antenna should work just fine. Here in the Southwest US, we tend to spread out further away from each other because of the extreme dust kicked up by each vehicle.

Thanks for the comment. It makes a change that an argument wasn't part of the response. I fully understand that UK situations are different to US situations but I'm prepared to listen to any suggestions. Many thanks

 

[adam1752]

I'm just starting on my journey of rig coms and i just started upgrading my CB set up and I'm looking for advice on a new antenna, i have a 3ft fire stick and I'm not quite satisfied with it so now I'm looking for a new antenna that is about the same size but has better range. so i could have a good cb set up before i start my journey in to the world of HAM and VHF.

 

[The other Sean]

I'm just starting on my journey of rig coms and i just started upgrading my CB set up and I'm looking for advice on a new antenna, i have a 3ft fire stick and I'm not quite satisfied with it so now I'm looking for a new antenna that is about the same size but has better range. so i could have a good cb set up before i start my journey in to the world of HAM and VHF.

Where on your vehicle is it mounted and what kind of vehicle?

 

[TerryD]

I had one of the fire stick 4' antennas and I really wasn't a fan of it. Maybe a short one mounted high would be better but the long one was heavy and the springs I could find either wouldn't control it or wouldn't allow any give.

I have a short SS whip with a base coil that I use on a mag mount with a NMO-3/8-24 adapter and it seems to do ok, but isn't really good offroad. Because of the base load coil it has to be mounted up high to function properly. I've run it on my lip mount on the rear gate of the Xterra but only as a RX antenna so I can't speak for how useful it was there.

 

[Graeman]

Short antennas really need to be mounted as high as possible on the vehicle. Any antenna needs to have more antenna above the vehicle than at or below the roofline. The other thing that is needed is tuning the antenna to the radio to get the best performance of the whole setup.

 

[Chris Arnesen]

The first thing to remember is that all antennas are a compromise from the optimal configuration. Once things are changed (length, position, etc) the capabilities will start to degrade.

For CB (in the U.S. anyhow), one wavelength is about 11 meters (36 feet). For most of us, having a 36 foot fishing pole hanging off the back of our rigs isn't an option so it must be shortened. A half-wavelength version would be 18 feet -- still a bit too long, so most CB users have a 9 foot antenna (one quarter-wavelength @ 102 inches).

Once you go shorter than one quarter-wavelength, manufacturers have to get really creative in order to keep your transmitter happy when you key-down. Unfortunately all of these changes will make your angle of radiation a lot steeper, lower your reception quality, and just overall degrade your experience. Sure, it "works" and your transmitter shows a 1 to 1 SWR match, however that is only one factor on choosing a good antenna.

I'll be adding CB to my truck soon and the plan is to use a traditional 102 inch whip with the mount/feedpoint bonded to the frame of the truck. Then during regular driving, I'll have the whip pulled back to the rear of the truck using an antenna whip tie-down. Not optimal for a good radiation pattern, but if I need that extra "punch" I can easily pull over and allow the antenna to stand straight up.

 

[adam1752]

Where on your vehicle is it mounted and what kind of vehicle?

driver side hood on a 06 4Runner

 

[adam1752]

thx all really helpful

 

[Defender 90 Keith]

Short antennas really need to be mounted as high as possible on the vehicle. Any antenna needs to have more antenna above the vehicle than at or below the roofline. The other thing that is needed is tuning the antenna to the radio to get the best performance of the whole setup.

thanks for the info re: tuning the antenna. thankfully this is Communications for the Beginner because my next question proves that I'm a beginner. here goes......... how does one tune the antenna to the radio?

 

[TerryD]

You use a SWR meter in line between the radio and the antenna and adjust for lowest SWR. You can get inexpensive SWR meters online and they come with detailed instructions to walk you through the process. You'll need a short coax jumper to go between the radio and SWR meter as well when you order the meter. Go ahead and buy a meter, if you are going to have a CB you should have the tools to keep it in working order! Hope this helps!

 

[Sean S]

I appreciate all the comments so far. my main question about the 2 options of aerial was to establish which was going to be the better option for me. Should I opt for the shorter one or the longer one?

the links to the 2 radios that I'm considering are:
http://www.thunderpole.co.uk/cb-radio-packs/thunderpole-cb-radio-executive-pack-tti-881.html

http://www.thunderpole.co.uk/cb-radio-packs/thunderpole-cb-radio-continental-pack-thunderpole-t-2000.html

thanks for the info re: tuning the antenna. thankfully this is Communications for the Beginner because my next question proves that I'm a beginner. here goes......... how does one tune the antenna to the radio?

I just had a look at both models you are interested in and they look very nice. I noticed that Thunderpole have created an excellent page devoted to tuning instructions specifically for their radios and antennas.

 

[Defender 90 Keith]

I just had a look at both models you are interested in and they look very nice. I noticed that Thunderpole have created an excellent page devoted to tuning instructions specifically for their radios and antennas.
View attachment 21229

Many thanks for the info. I did say that I was a complete beginner, having never used a CB for personal reasons. my only radio communications experience was during my quarter century Naval background. I never had much reason to play with the configuration and aerials.

I now have to convince Senior Management (the wife) that a CB is essential

 

[Jeckel]

I'm not an expert, but if I could only have one radio, I'd have one of these and program it with FRS channels.

View attachment 11477


On the four OB trips I've been on, FRS was the most common.

FRS is limited to less than 1 watt. I think 1/2 watt. Using the baofeng to transmit on frs frequencies is inviting a small fine from the FCC. Of course, you might want to look into what a "small fcc fine" is :)